He wrote, "Jesus Christ spoke in this manner; I do as my Father before me did. However we have to then deal with the problem of Joseph being well versed on such matters yet somehow not getting the whole point of these texts. Exactly Geri! I believe that I am a child of a God, a child of a loving Heavenly Father and Mother with a divine heritage. Those Brothers and Sisters bore witness to me additionally of the Truth of multiple Probationary Earths, my witnesses are in the hundreds and I cannot deny them, Harold, thank you for sharing your special experience and witness. I probably just need to read a book about it. And thank you Greg. I experienced a baptism of fire when I was only 14 years old and it has sustained me my entire life. their state became a state of probation, 2 Ne. How have most LDS people come to learn of the concept of multiple probations? So, I'll just comment that thepoints you bring up nicely illustrate some of the basictension that this theology introduces. But I can understand a model where the soul continues to return to learn new things and progress. When I have read the account where the church leaders during the Saviors time were asking him if he were Jeremiah or some other great prophet, that never made sense to me until after reading your book, then it made perfect sense to me. Another example comes as I try to understand the meaning of eternal lives. Men and Women who Valiantly bring this (Exalting Knowledge) to those who wish to ascend. That was a Wow moment! as insights and spiritual impressions have come, I have not wanted to share the You are obviously gifted and inspired by God. The doctrine of multiple probations again increases my understanding of eternal lives. Thank you for sharing. See 1 Corinthians 15:40-44. Thank you Eric. through contrasts. There is a real fear of being labeled an apostate for believing these messages and for even having had my own experiences. I admire your truth seeking and truth-recognizing abilities. No wonder they were so arrogant. It is hard to feel like you live in a closet and that church has been a lonely experience at times. And it speaks that our destination after this life, even if we come up short of the Glory of God could not possibly be our final destination for eternity. I believe this to be truth. God bless you for speaking truth. I view these gifts largely to be the result of mortal Why the title and what needs to happen to have that title. Ill just simply say that time and space in the eternities is measured differently than here in the telestial world and all things are possible. In fact, he attributed his identification of Michael as God the Father to JS' commentary on Daniel and JS' equivalence of Adam, Michael, and the Ancient of Days. I have felt the Cleansing power of Jesus Christ through His Atonement. This helps restore piecesand so the restoration continues! That one would be tempted to say this life is just too hard. Just think of the fun rides in life one could take though Ken! Erika, these are great questions. Thank you Eric, Greg and Julie for your Multiple Probations book, essays and podcasts of supporting scripture and history. We often use this scripture to support the concept of a pre-mortal life, but we would have to assume that it is possible to commit a sin while there in a spirit state. But in the essay I kept hoping for a more in depth explanation of why and how this could be considered LDS doctrine. Big Florida development project likely worth $40-80B in 30-60 years. Thank you, Gregory! I realized it was up to me to ask, seek, knock, learn and apply with or without him. Some have accused those who believe this doctrine as seeking dangerous doctrine. I have to be honest. : And one lifetime is more than enough, if that lifetime lasts for eternity! When I first heard of it, it made perfect sense to me and was exhilarating to my soul. That stopped me in my tracks and I didnt know quite how to answer that. Libraries. Wow. It makes so much sense to me. When your book came out with Greg I was excited to read it and I did several times. various sects of Christianity as a true and practical doctrine, as evidenced by and forms participate in forms) This form of Elijahness (which is to be distinguished from the individual Elijah) is reincarnated in that many individuals can participate in this form. The is it confuses the radical contingency Mormon theology grants God in his being (rather than being a necessary being) with a God whodoesfall. In the 1840s their polygamous relationship to the Mormon prophet was as secret as his conversion to reincarnation. And now I know that the lower I choose to descend, the more opportunity I will have to ascend higher. Ive learned to not voice my experiences at church as well. mistake in my mind as to who the authors of the two variations are. I must continually ask myself the question, Who am I to believe that Gods work is dependent on my understanding, teaching and attempting to enlighten the unenlightened? I must also daily keep in mind my own nothingness and utter reliance on The Savior of The World (2 Nephi 4). There is only one truth but countless falsehoods. I can see that in the spiritual world it goes way beyond any earthly graduate school I can imagine. Thank you again for bringing more clarity of the Great Plan to light. One lifetime and you are done feels like temporary progression. The passage I was given is found in D&C 76 which also happens to be about the Mysteries of Godliness: D&C 76:41-44 Im grateful you shared your experience here! Save my name, email, and website in this browser for the next time I comment. In my opinion Alma 5 and Alma 12, in their entirety, are both worthy of consideration along side many other scriptures that follow a pattern which is familiar to me. Another point on this, it is said in the bible that men like Adam, Methuselah, and Enoch were men who became perfect in their generation. Well done, Eric. Orson Pratt apparently wasn't in on it or hadn't understood it as others had. specifics with others. Both Brigham and Heber were indoctrinated in the principles and I suspect others, particularly W.W. Phelps. Because I do just that I have grown closer to the Savior and because I study scripture, I have more enlightenment and understanding of truth. I am a witness that these promises are true. 2:43 p.m. John Thomas is conducting cross . We say that one has to go to the grave to be born again in Christ. With this possible equivalency between Micheal and the Holy Ghost in mind and JS' probable belief that all were to serve as Holy Ghosts prior to being Christs, JS likely believed the Nauvoo endowment was a representation of one stage of what each heir of the celestial kingdom was to pass through in their climb up the ladder of exaltation. So I see first hand the effects of not knowing for myself what is truth vs error. This could easily explain what Joseph Smith was inferring when he said the following Though some of the sheep may wander, the eye of the Shepherd is upon them, and sooner or later they will feel the tentacles of Divine Providence reaching out after them and drawing them back to the fold. Her experience helps to counter some of the false beliefs we have about suicide. That is a possibility, but it's more likely that his late teachings that can be interpreted as reincarnation are exactly that, considering how many of his contemporaries understood that he did teach it some form or another. deep questions about the eternities and the knowledge satisfied our questions Because LDS leaders sometimes refer to this life, before our death and eventual resurrection, as our "mortal probation," based on the scriptural term "probationary state," Daybell and Vallow call their belief in reincarnation "multiple mortal probations." Especially that your own witness didnt come from a human. Thank you for reading this essay. Multiple Probations: A Lost Doctrine Remembered Aug 11, 2022. by Eric Smith . 9:27. continue in the path until the end of the day of probation, 2 Ne. This implication is emphasized by JS' teachings on identifying angels vs. evil spirits (found in D&C), which he taught on multiple occasions, maybe 5 or 6 times, before and after the Nauvoo endowment had been administered. assigned to a kingdom of glory, whether Telestial, Terrestrial, or Celestial, Some may ask why I or anyone else have been privileged to learn of these doctrines while others have not. Choose one innovative idea the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints has announced in the last 10 years. There is deeper meaning in this i wont go into here but i love and admire both of you and the way you both gracefully and meekly bring about true doctrines to light. . The thought of multiple probations is really interesting to me and honestly makes a lot of sense. Multiple Mortal Probations (MMP) Eternal Progression, and Progression between Kingdoms The Flag of the Kingdom of God Apostasy Unchangeability of the Doctrines of Salvation and Exaltation Fallibility or Infallibility of Men Appointed as Church Leaders Whether or Not the LDS Church Could Fall into Apostasy How does this concept coexist with the idea of eternal families? Eric, The church of Jesus Christ of Latter Day Saints official stance on multiple mortal probations (similar to reincarnation) is that is the doctrine of the devil. could not look upon God, except hisgloryshould come upon me, and I For the uninitiated, Multiple Mortal Probation (MMP) is similar to the concept of reincarnation. It is grasped in a such a powerful symbol the baptism. But, I know this is absolutely trueAnd thank the Stalwart!! Eric, [a] The Triumph and Glory of the Lamb: Doctrine and Covenants 76 in Its Historical Context Email from me is very sparse. It has been referred to many times in this essay and the comments as doctrine. How did we live in the pre mortal realms and agree to a plan to come here where we only had one shot to get it right? I share your enthusiasm for truth regardless of its source. In 1786, a guy named John Zephaniah Holwell published a tract called "Dissertation on the Origin of Intelligent Beings, and on Divine Providence".I recommend it to anybody curious about the ideas of a premortal existence, war in heaven, plan of salvation, opposition in all things, infant baptism, free agency, multiple mortal probations, etc. a new area shows as that there has to be also an end of another time also a wording of that multiple times.. or multiple probations.. Rowe was excommunicated from The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints after . Blessings to all seekers. Do you have a direct link? We welcome comments of all kinds on this blog and feel that people should be free to debate and discuss the topics in accordance with their personal views, so long as it is done in a courteous and respectful manner. Required fields are marked *. I remember feeling a heavy emotion even as a very young person that I would now call despair, when I first learned this. The Savior is crucial to the plan, and only He is the way back no matter how many probations we have had. Please consider subscribing in order to receive these updates. I love our Lord and Savior Jesus Christ and I know He loves me. Thank you Kim. I thought I had reached the bottom of the rabbit holeI guess it goes deeper still. It should be made clear that the denomination Brigham Young founded in 1851, the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints, has rejected these teachings. I was once looking at the wickedness of the world and lamenting the fact that so few in this generation appear to be on a path to come to know Christ and therefore lacking what is needed to enter into His kingdom (JST Matt 7:33). This is not a final conclusion by any means, but this strikes me as Joseph Smith trying to get to his next level of understanding and thinking some of his own thoughts on certain things short of getting a definitive revelation on the subject. Cristina Rosetti says there are groups of Mormon fundamentalists who believe in multiple probations, living several lives to reach exaltation. News. Item #6a. He was the first director of Religious Studies in the college administration. Lori, and her husband Chad, allegedly murdered Lori's children "JJ" Vallow, 7, Tylee . My only doubt was in me and the ability to live the gospel of Jesus Christ. Another George Laub journal entry on JS' Sermon In the Grove seems to confirm that this is how Laub understood it. Which is not what actually happens. millions of people from around the world are part of the church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints . February 28, 2017 in General Discussions. Since I hardly want to finish this round, I definitely don't want to do "multiple mortal probations." I will ponder about it and ask Heavenly Father. This group gives us a safe platform in which we discuss the trials, tribulations, prophecies and signs of the last dispensation of which we live in. I feel like this life is equivalent to a year in school and I am in 5th grade. You must understand that this is a very poor argument. Praise be to God and the Lamb!! [1] As long as I don't come back as a cockroach or some kind of insect. May we find Him now. to inherit the same glory, the same power and the same exaltation, until you ascend the throne of eternal power the same as those who are gone before. Thank You Eric, Beautifully expressed! are so advanced in their abilities and gifts from birth, such as music, art, One should note that reincarnation in Kabbalism isn't reincarnation of a full person but is more akin to Platonic notions. In other words we might live on this earth multiple times before we are finally resurrected . If this were false, then why do I want to strive to be a better disciple of Jesus Christ? As I have sought to understand my past before this life, and I have not ever been constrained by The Spirit to speak in ways that invite others to look to me for the answers that must only come from Father. Kalai, mahalo for visiting and sharing your views. true, it should only come through certain lines of authority. Joseph well understood multiple probation, but to openly teach it would have meant major upheaval and further loss of members. What an incredible doctrine of mercy and hope! Not all probation is negative; quite often, it is merely counsel to attend the temple more, read select scriptures, or pray more frequently and fervently. Yet they lived on the earth at the beginning when it was nearly still a paradise, and they lived to almost 1000 years before dying. These ware resurrected Bodies, Violated the Celestial laws.
lds church multiple probations